I have attended the rally for the last four or five years and it is in the main worthwhile. My only problem is the presence of the IRA supporters and Sein Fein claiming that they are anti racist? I have trouble rationalising this? The turnout yesterday was down on previous years? Is this a cause?

jascarlin wrote:

I have attended the rally for the last four or five years and it is in the main worthwhile. My only problem is the presence of the IRA supporters and Sein Fein claiming that they are anti racist? I have trouble rationalising this? The turnout yesterday was down on previous years? Is this a cause?

Irish people have suffered from racism for hundreds of years thanks to British imperialism. I think Irish republicans have every right to come on an anti-racist demonstration, however much I might disagree with other aspects of their politics.

jascarlin wrote:

I have attended the rally for the last four or five years and it is in the main worthwhile. My only problem is the presence of the IRA supporters and Sein Fein claiming that they are anti racist? I have trouble rationalising this? The turnout yesterday was down on previous years? Is this a cause?

I didnt hear or see any support for the IRA on the march. what i did see was a significant number of republicans in Glasgow supporting anti-rascism.

what trouble do you have that republicans are also anti-rascist?

I also found the presence of Sinn Fein made me uneasy. Sectarianism is racism, and in reality these groups are perceived to be supported for 'communal' reasons rather than political ones. It's hardly supporting unity or celebrating diversity.

There was a flag with Bobby Sands on it in the 'Sinn Fein' section and also a group with a banner for 'Republican Sinn Fein', so I certainly saw support for the IRA at the march.

Anonymous wrote:

I also found the presence of Sinn Fein made me uneasy. Sectarianism is racism, and in reality these groups are perceived to be supported for 'communal' reasons rather than political ones. It's hardly supporting unity or celebrating diversity.

There was a flag with Bobby Sands on it in the 'Sinn Fein' section and also a group with a banner for 'Republican Sinn Fein', so I certainly saw support for the IRA at the march.

Republicanism is by nature a non sectarian organisation founded by Protestants for the working class people. The Republicans on the march including myself and also a few recent marches lately know the true understanding of this and are fericly anti-racist.

Why did Sinn Fein make you uneasy because it is too close to home for you I bet you have no doubt in supporting other oppressed people all over the world.

This is what annoys me about all your anti facists yous would never try and deal with an Orange walk even thought they are just as bigoted as the SDL,EDL and BNP.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I also found the presence of Sinn Fein made me uneasy. Sectarianism is racism, and in reality these groups are perceived to be supported for 'communal' reasons rather than political ones. It's hardly supporting unity or celebrating diversity.

There was a flag with Bobby Sands on it in the 'Sinn Fein' section and also a group with a banner for 'Republican Sinn Fein', so I certainly saw support for the IRA at the march.

Republicanism is by nature a non sectarian organisation founded by Protestants for the working class people. The Republicans on the march including myself and also a few recent marches lately know the true understanding of this and are fericly anti-racist.

Why did Sinn Fein make you uneasy because it is too close to home for you I bet you have no doubt in supporting other oppressed people all over the world.

This is what annoys me about all your anti facists yous would never try and deal with an Orange walk even thought they are just as bigoted as the SDL,EDL and BNP.

 

The Orange Order weren't on the St Andrew's day march. A lot of people in England and a very few in Scotland has been affected by the IRA bombings on mainland Britain. My point is when the public see the IRA banners in a march they think of the bombings and they will possibly think that ALL the marchers are in sympathy with the IRA marchers? Sympathy for the march as a whole will be lessened and I think that the low turnout on the march may well be because of their presence? I have attended over thirty political marches in Glasgow, Edinburgh and Dundee in the last 5 or 6 years and this the only one where they show up except for the ones they themselves organize? Correct me if I am wrong? I think their presence sends out the wrong message to the public and the St Andrew's day march and aims suffers for it?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I also found the presence of Sinn Fein made me uneasy. Sectarianism is racism, and in reality these groups are perceived to be supported for 'communal' reasons rather than political ones. It's hardly supporting unity or celebrating diversity.

There was a flag with Bobby Sands on it in the 'Sinn Fein' section and also a group with a banner for 'Republican Sinn Fein', so I certainly saw support for the IRA at the march.

Republicanism is by nature a non sectarian organisation founded by Protestants for the working class people. The Republicans on the march including myself and also a few recent marches lately know the true understanding of this and are fericly anti-racist.

Why did Sinn Fein make you uneasy because it is too close to home for you I bet you have no doubt in supporting other oppressed people all over the world.

This is what annoys me about all your anti facists yous would never try and deal with an Orange walk even thought they are just as bigoted as the SDL,EDL and BNP.

The Orange walks are not bigoted and you can not compare its members to those of the BNP. The Orange Order admited blacks and Red Indians into its ranks long before most organisations allowed people of thses races to be treated as equals.

The Orange Order was formed after the Defenders, A roman Catholic gang, attacked Protestant homes. It was formed to counter act the threat of militant Roman Catholic Nationalism. You are right in stating that the Republican movement was started by Protestants, they were influenced by the Revolutions in France and America and they hoped to end the discrimination against presbyterians. Sadly the Roman Catholics used the United Irishmen orgainisation which the radical Ulster Scots Presbyterians played a huge part in forming as a means to carry out a secterian campaign against Prostestants living in Ireland.

The United Irishmen had some brave leaders in the North such as Henry Joy McCraken but they were defeated in battles including the famous the Battle of Antrim in 1798 and many of its leaders were hanged for treason. In the South were the majority of United Irishmen were Roman Catholics there were some terrible attrocities commited such as the attack on Vinegar Hill in which Protestant women and children were butchered. This and the other attacks on protestants and their homes forced the Protestants to act against the campaign of rebellion and ethnic cleansing.

The modern Republican movement although it claims to be against secterianism is dominated by Roman Catholics and during the troubles attacks have carried out against Protestant homes on interface areas. There are also continued attacks made against the Protestant community in Northern Ireland and the border areas.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I also found the presence of Sinn Fein made me uneasy. Sectarianism is racism, and in reality these groups are perceived to be supported for 'communal' reasons rather than political ones. It's hardly supporting unity or celebrating diversity.

There was a flag with Bobby Sands on it in the 'Sinn Fein' section and also a group with a banner for 'Republican Sinn Fein', so I certainly saw support for the IRA at the march.

Republicanism is by nature a non sectarian organisation founded by Protestants for the working class people. The Republicans on the march including myself and also a few recent marches lately know the true understanding of this and are fericly anti-racist.

Why did Sinn Fein make you uneasy because it is too close to home for you I bet you have no doubt in supporting other oppressed people all over the world.

This is what annoys me about all your anti facists yous would never try and deal with an Orange walk even thought they are just as bigoted as the SDL,EDL and BNP.

The Orange walks are not bigoted and you can not compare its members to those of the BNP. The Orange Order admited blacks and Red Indians into its ranks long before most organisations allowed people of thses races to be treated as equals.

The Orange Order was formed after the Defenders, A roman Catholic gang, attacked Protestant homes. It was formed to counter act the threat of militant Roman Catholic Nationalism. You are right in stating that the Republican movement was started by Protestants, they were influenced by the Revolutions in France and America and they hoped to end the discrimination against presbyterians. Sadly the Roman Catholics used the United Irishmen orgainisation which the radical Ulster Scots Presbyterians played a huge part in forming as a means to carry out a secterian campaign against Prostestants living in Ireland.

The United Irishmen had some brave leaders in the North such as Henry Joy McCraken but they were defeated in battles including the famous the Battle of Antrim in 1798 and many of its leaders were hanged for treason. In the South were the majority of United Irishmen were Roman Catholics there were some terrible attrocities commited such as the attack on Vinegar Hill in which Protestant women and children were butchered. This and the other attacks on protestants and their homes forced the Protestants to act against the campaign of rebellion and ethnic cleansing.

The modern Republican movement although it claims to be against secterianism is dominated by Roman Catholics and during the troubles attacks have carried out against Protestant homes on interface areas. There are also continued attacks made against the Protestant community in Northern Ireland and the border areas.

 

No such thing happened at Vinegar Hill as a matter of fact. Unionists distorting history as usual.

The Orange Order was originally in favour of maintaining the Dublin Parliament rather than union with Westminster. They thought it would be easier to keep the Irish down without well-meaning English reformers and radicals being able to interfere with the workings of the Portestant ascendency.

No such thing happened at Vinegar Hill as a matter of fact. Unionists distorting history as usual.

The Orange Order was originally in favour of maintaining the Dublin Parliament rather than union with Westminster. They thought it would be easier to keep the Irish down without well-meaning English reformers and radicals being able to interfere with the workings of the Portestant ascendency.

everyone distorts history for their own ends. it isn't helped when both sides are so entrenched ethnically.

the fact is there's been atrocities committed by both sides in the conflict, and when i look at it rationally i can't justify taking sides in the republicans/loyalists debate because i don't know enough about the history of the conflict

the other thing is that, because of my ethnicity and the church i went to as a child i know which side i am on, which colours and flags make me uncomfortable or not and whose side i instinctively feel sympathy for no matter how much my rational mind says they're all just as bad as each other and it's better to stay out of it if you've got the option (which, being from an area with no history of sectarian violence, i do)

i do think the republicans have a right to march on the rally, but it's a bit obvious that it's going to make some people nervous isn't it? in a city where you can get stabbed for wearing the wrong colour shirt in the wrong part of town

To the ill-informed orange man Most off your information is distoreted for your own opinion./

Fair play to the STUC as the group that represents the Irish in Scotland were refused many anti-Irish racism marches due to threats of violence from Loyalists/BNP.

Anonymous wrote:

To the ill-informed orange man Most off your information is distoreted for your own opinion./

Fair play to the STUC as the group that represents the Irish in Scotland were refused many anti-Irish racism marches due to threats of violence from Loyalists/BNP.

To the ill-informed republican, massacres of Protestants did occur in County Wexford during the United Irishman rebellion. The Roman Catholic church and the republican movement have tried to white wash their bloody history but there are still those who are interested in the truth.

Anonymous wrote:

To the ill-informed orange man Most off your information is distoreted for your own opinion./

Fair play to the STUC as the group that represents the Irish in Scotland were refused many anti-Irish racism marches due to threats of violence from Loyalists/BNP.

Getting the left to unite to take on the Tories and New Labour is very difficult. Convincing the working class to agree to a unified stragedy is the way to go? People on the streets of Glagow thinking about this and seeing a STUC march with tricolours in their midst will turn many of them off? A solution would be for republicans to take part if they wish but not waving their flags? Very few working class people support them, even among catholics? The flags were divisive on a "unity" march.

jascarlin wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

To the ill-informed orange man Most off your information is distoreted for your own opinion./

Fair play to the STUC as the group that represents the Irish in Scotland were refused many anti-Irish racism marches due to threats of violence from Loyalists/BNP.

Getting the left to unite to take on the Tories and New Labour is very difficult. Convincing the working class to agree to a unified stragedy is the way to go? People on the streets of Glagow thinking about this and seeing a STUC march with tricolours in their midst will turn many of them off? A solution would be for republicans to take part if they wish but not waving their flags? Very few working class people support them, even among catholics? The flags were divisive on a "unity" march.

This is a very sensible comment. The republican banners would be enough to put most people off of the Trade Union movement and they certainly had no place in a march of this description. It is a shame that militant republicans are hijacking protests and movements of this nature.

jascarlin wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

To the ill-informed orange man Most off your information is distoreted for your own opinion./

Fair play to the STUC as the group that represents the Irish in Scotland were refused many anti-Irish racism marches due to threats of violence from Loyalists/BNP.

Getting the left to unite to take on the Tories and New Labour is very difficult. Convincing the working class to agree to a unified stragedy is the way to go? People on the streets of Glagow thinking about this and seeing a STUC march with tricolours in their midst will turn many of them off? A solution would be for republicans to take part if they wish but not waving their flags? Very few working class people support them, even among catholics? The flags were divisive on a "unity" march.

From reading your comment I can understand where your comming from as Republicans are trying to appeal to the Irish community so are the Trade unionists. There were no hardcore flags are the march maybe the disaprence of Tri-colours instead just the banners they had to highlight the fact of Anti-Irish racism that carrys on till today.

Anonymous wrote:

jascarlin wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

To the ill-informed orange man Most off your information is distoreted for your own opinion./

Fair play to the STUC as the group that represents the Irish in Scotland were refused many anti-Irish racism marches due to threats of violence from Loyalists/BNP.

Getting the left to unite to take on the Tories and New Labour is very difficult. Convincing the working class to agree to a unified stragedy is the way to go? People on the streets of Glagow thinking about this and seeing a STUC march with tricolours in their midst will turn many of them off? A solution would be for republicans to take part if they wish but not waving their flags? Very few working class people support them, even among catholics? The flags were divisive on a "unity" march.

From reading your comment I can understand where your comming from as Republicans are trying to appeal to the Irish community so are the Trade unionists. There were no hardcore flags are the march maybe the disaprence of Tri-colours instead just the banners they had to highlight the fact of Anti-Irish racism that carrys on till today.

What about anti-English rascism?

CH wrote:Have hidden some comments for breaching the editorial policy. Want to make political criticisms of Republicanism / Unionism? Fine. Want to mix political criticisms with falsehoods, insults and bigotry? Take it elsewhere.

Typical CH bullshit, I don't agree, so CENSORED...!!

CENSOR away then (including this no doubt!) 

Anonymous wrote:

CH wrote:Have hidden some comments for breaching the editorial policy. Want to make political criticisms of Republicanism / Unionism? Fine. Want to mix political criticisms with falsehoods, insults and bigotry? Take it elsewhere.

Typical CH bullshit, I don't agree, so CENSORED...!!

CENSOR away then (including this no doubt!) 

Yep. Really oppressing your freedoms of speech by removing comments like "Irish tramps".

Grow up. Troll elsewhere.